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TURN BASED CINEMATOGRAPHY
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CloseSo this kind of a reccomendation/research topic into something oddly specific. But I'm wondering what are 3D games with turn based combat that have good camera direction? The most obvious are probably the Final Fantasy PS1 games. One of the interesting components of turn based combat is that the camera can be fairly unrestricted since most of the gameplay is done through selecting targets and skills via menus. If there's any RPG/Strategy or simular type of game out there that really takes presentation to a whole new level or did something interesting that sticks out in your mind, I'd like to know about it.
Lost Oydessey is the most recent modern example I can think of (sadly). There's a neat Gears of War-esque shakey cam shot for the attacks. It does a pretty standard one for the enemies yet the contrast adds to who is the protagonist and who isn't. Still it could be better in parts. Everything's gotten more and more real time/action based since so it's harder to find leading examples that fit this style.
I invite also a discussion of what you make of it. Things that would be cool to see utilized more. Idk I'm open to any idea that's tengentally related to this. I'm not too interested in balancing how long/skippable they need to be in order to not break gameplay flow. I think that's a given thing to address regardless of the quality of the camera work and the animations. I'd like to focus on the cool shit atm.
Lost Oydessey is the most recent modern example I can think of (sadly). There's a neat Gears of War-esque shakey cam shot for the attacks. It does a pretty standard one for the enemies yet the contrast adds to who is the protagonist and who isn't. Still it could be better in parts. Everything's gotten more and more real time/action based since so it's harder to find leading examples that fit this style.
I invite also a discussion of what you make of it. Things that would be cool to see utilized more. Idk I'm open to any idea that's tengentally related to this. I'm not too interested in balancing how long/skippable they need to be in order to not break gameplay flow. I think that's a given thing to address regardless of the quality of the camera work and the animations. I'd like to focus on the cool shit atm.
Shinan
4314
In some ways the new XCOM and Battletech games try to be cool with cinematography in their combats but the fact is that so often I'm more annoyed by it than not and try to minimize the cinematography in the options. Usually because you are fighting so much that information efficiency feels more important than cool camera angles.
The one game where I really liked the cinema camera though was in Frozen Cortex (I'm gonna link it because it's a game more people need to play) and that's because of the simultaneous turn based system it used. So a turn is planned out and you press "execute" and both teams move at the same time which is the perfect time to also make it look cool. Because regular turn based cool camera doesn't look all that cool because everyone else is just standing still doing nothing. (See XCOM where your guy does a dash and jumps over an obstacle and through a window and it's badass but... nothing happens around him while he does that)
The one game where I really liked the cinema camera though was in Frozen Cortex (I'm gonna link it because it's a game more people need to play) and that's because of the simultaneous turn based system it used. So a turn is planned out and you press "execute" and both teams move at the same time which is the perfect time to also make it look cool. Because regular turn based cool camera doesn't look all that cool because everyone else is just standing still doing nothing. (See XCOM where your guy does a dash and jumps over an obstacle and through a window and it's badass but... nothing happens around him while he does that)
I think the problem of having epic shots in a turn-based game is that it gets old rather quick. In XCOM it only works sometimes, when something cool happens like an enemy shooting at you an missing you.
The recent Pokemon games have dabbled in this too, especially during important boss battles. The camera will pan across the field, cutting between the different trainers and their 'mons from time to time in order to keep things interesting. It gives the battles a sense of constant movement and momentum, even when you're just waiting on the menu.
noajang
0
I absolutely love Lost Odyssey's dramatic camera in battle too. Adds so much to what is a relatively simple system under the hood. Not nearly as sophisticated, but I also really liked what Mistwalker's other 360 game, Blue Dragon, did on a character's turn, where they have a dramatic, manga panel-esque cut-in of a character rendered in real time when you're entering commands. The models have that plastic doll look that was common for early HD RPGs, and aren't nearly as emotive as they ought to be to sell the effect, but I thought it was an awesome idea. Your text to link here...
I also remember Grandia 3 having a cool camera in battle. I think it's mandated in part due to the nature of the battle system and how much movement there is compared to most other command based RPGs, but I like the way that it swoops and darts around the battlefield and always seems to be on the move and tracking the action. Doesn't feel like it slows down the battle system either, as more dramatic camera work sometimes does. Not the greatest game, but definitely dig its presentation.
I also remember Grandia 3 having a cool camera in battle. I think it's mandated in part due to the nature of the battle system and how much movement there is compared to most other command based RPGs, but I like the way that it swoops and darts around the battlefield and always seems to be on the move and tracking the action. Doesn't feel like it slows down the battle system either, as more dramatic camera work sometimes does. Not the greatest game, but definitely dig its presentation.
LordBlueRouge
2143
Great Thread, I'm posting here so I won't forget to post in it later, before throwing in some examples. But I remember playing Final Fantasy 13 and the intro sort of harkens back to FF7 and FF10, same old, nothing really new. A couple of months later I take a look at Lost Odyssey's Intro. Lost Odyssey's Intro is more Final Fantasy than Final Fantasy 13 ever was. if you thought FF7's intro was crazy, Lost Odyssey was like it's natural predecessor. And to me, it's crazy and sad how things turned out the way that they did, cause I would've loved to see what a current Sakaguchi final fantasy game would've played like.
I wouldn't say Sakaguchi had a cinematic eye, but he was definitely thinking about this stuff while putting these games together. I feel like, if he had a chance to continue working on these sort of games, it would've been really neat to see where modern designers would have taken this further. I'll go into it more once I uploaded a couple of examples. FF7 had a lot of great examples, to the point where they start using it less and less in later entries, which is disappointing, cause I really wanted to play a game where, you're fighting a boss of some sort, but then something unsettling happens, something feels "off" and that feeling starts shows up in the camera.
There's other ways to tell stories through video games, but it feels like from 2007 and onward, they stopped exploring it through in-game camera work, because it got way too expensive to experiment with. But yeah, very interesting thread here. I'll try to upload some stuff when I have some more free time.
I wouldn't say Sakaguchi had a cinematic eye, but he was definitely thinking about this stuff while putting these games together. I feel like, if he had a chance to continue working on these sort of games, it would've been really neat to see where modern designers would have taken this further. I'll go into it more once I uploaded a couple of examples. FF7 had a lot of great examples, to the point where they start using it less and less in later entries, which is disappointing, cause I really wanted to play a game where, you're fighting a boss of some sort, but then something unsettling happens, something feels "off" and that feeling starts shows up in the camera.
There's other ways to tell stories through video games, but it feels like from 2007 and onward, they stopped exploring it through in-game camera work, because it got way too expensive to experiment with. But yeah, very interesting thread here. I'll try to upload some stuff when I have some more free time.
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