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[POLL] [RM2K3] ANY INTEREST IN A CMS MAKER?
Poll
Are you interested in a CMS maker for RM2k3? - Results
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Yes
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2
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50%
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No
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1
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25%
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Other (explain in the thread)
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1
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25%
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Posts
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Aldu
1020
Aldu
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CloseThe official version of RPG Maker 2003 is amazing but it has one problem: if you want to create custom systems, you need to manually make it using event commands. All of the other versions support scripting and plugins; even RPG Tsukuru 2003 has DynRPG.
So here's my idea: Create an engine using event commands that allows any RM2k3 developer to copy/paste common events to their existing project to quickly get a working CMS. After that, all they need to do is edit switches/variables to toggle features and use X/Y coordinates to position each element of the menu. The developer can import new graphics using the same filenames to replace the default ones. I've also thought about adding additional features like item categories, HP/MP bars, and options menu (to toggle fullscreen and open video settings).
I've documented how it would work and created a prototype which you can test out for yourself:
Download: Aldu Engine 2k3 Prototype.zip
All switches, variables and common events are placed at 1000+. To make changes, go to the Database -> Common Event 1001: Initial Setup or press F9 in test mode. Press Shift in-game to open the CMS.
Keep in mind that it's not fully functional, but it will give you an idea of how it works.
I've been a bit hesitant to proceed further because it would take some time to develop so please let me know if you're interested.
So here's my idea: Create an engine using event commands that allows any RM2k3 developer to copy/paste common events to their existing project to quickly get a working CMS. After that, all they need to do is edit switches/variables to toggle features and use X/Y coordinates to position each element of the menu. The developer can import new graphics using the same filenames to replace the default ones. I've also thought about adding additional features like item categories, HP/MP bars, and options menu (to toggle fullscreen and open video settings).
I've documented how it would work and created a prototype which you can test out for yourself:
Download: Aldu Engine 2k3 Prototype.zip
All switches, variables and common events are placed at 1000+. To make changes, go to the Database -> Common Event 1001: Initial Setup or press F9 in test mode. Press Shift in-game to open the CMS.
Keep in mind that it's not fully functional, but it will give you an idea of how it works.
I've been a bit hesitant to proceed further because it would take some time to develop so please let me know if you're interested.
Darken
3952
If there ever was way to modify/generate the RPG_RT.ltb file (the file that contains all the database stuff and more importantly common events) then ideally I can imagine a custom made application where you could dynamically build your own CMS.
Otherwise you're kind of dealing with making a bunch of templates which people have sorta done in the past I think but the challenge being that it needs to have a lot of readability and enough flexibility to make it worth it. There's also to consider the type of users in mind.
Most people who want a CMS I imagine usually want it for non-RPGs where a simple default inventory isn't enough. It's nebulous on what the needs are for that I guess, but probably something for horror games.
Then there are people who are making RPGs but likely just want a character customization menu (skill trees) potentially separate from the main menu itself.
Beyond that I guess is a CMS that mimics the default RPG menu, displays all the stats/equipments and inventory but allows enough modification to mimic a basic menu plugin in VX Ace.
(I downloaded your thing but I don't think it has anything of note beyond 2 test NPCs)
Otherwise you're kind of dealing with making a bunch of templates which people have sorta done in the past I think but the challenge being that it needs to have a lot of readability and enough flexibility to make it worth it. There's also to consider the type of users in mind.
Most people who want a CMS I imagine usually want it for non-RPGs where a simple default inventory isn't enough. It's nebulous on what the needs are for that I guess, but probably something for horror games.
Then there are people who are making RPGs but likely just want a character customization menu (skill trees) potentially separate from the main menu itself.
Beyond that I guess is a CMS that mimics the default RPG menu, displays all the stats/equipments and inventory but allows enough modification to mimic a basic menu plugin in VX Ace.
(I downloaded your thing but I don't think it has anything of note beyond 2 test NPCs)
Aldu
1020
Thanks for sharing your opinion. I think there's still a target audience for this framework; especially new developers or someone who wants to implement a CMS quickly for their game. I've created multiple CMS/CBS on RM2k3 so I think it'd be nice if there was a system that was scalable and customizable so less time is spent on the functionality and more on the design/menu content itself.
Have you followed the instructions and changed the switches/variables in the database? The purpose of downloading the prototype is to test out the customization features. Here's a menu design I made in less than 20 minutes using the prototype:
(I downloaded your thing but I don't think it has anything of note beyond 2 test NPCs)
Have you followed the instructions and changed the switches/variables in the database? The purpose of downloading the prototype is to test out the customization features. Here's a menu design I made in less than 20 minutes using the prototype:
Darken
3952
Yeah I just didn't know shift was the actual menu key to check the menu.
Regarding essentially the idea of an editable menu that resembles the default RPG menu at first...
The use problem I guess is expecting the user to want to change item/equip names in the pictures along with the ones in the database. Then there's retrieving the item/equip values or the description of the item etc. You're using sprite sheets to essentially cutdown on the amount of separate pictures (or to not rely on pic pointer) but I'm going to assume there's gonna be manual values (say what a potion actually does) and editing a lot of pictures in a concise way for the user to get what they want.
If you're willing to jump through hoops to do that then you're probably willing to make a CMS yourself. Granted this offers a nice headstart, but an absolutely new developer might struggle a little considering it's replacing aspects of using the database. Idk if this will be a way to bridge the gap so to speak.
Regarding essentially the idea of an editable menu that resembles the default RPG menu at first...
The use problem I guess is expecting the user to want to change item/equip names in the pictures along with the ones in the database. Then there's retrieving the item/equip values or the description of the item etc. You're using sprite sheets to essentially cutdown on the amount of separate pictures (or to not rely on pic pointer) but I'm going to assume there's gonna be manual values (say what a potion actually does) and editing a lot of pictures in a concise way for the user to get what they want.
If you're willing to jump through hoops to do that then you're probably willing to make a CMS yourself. Granted this offers a nice headstart, but an absolutely new developer might struggle a little considering it's replacing aspects of using the database. Idk if this will be a way to bridge the gap so to speak.
Here's the thing: if I want a custom system with scripting, I can use VXAce or MV. I can even make it look like 2k/3 if I double/triple graphic sizes. If I want systems unique to 2k/3, scripting will even let me do that. There is absolutely no reason I couldn't make a game any of those systems that looks like a 2k/3 game, and the only reason you'd know is because of the filing system. I can even give them 2k/3 resolution.
The reason I say this is because I have made the majority of my games in 2k3 and what makes it interesting for me is that very limitation of only having the events to make custom systems. It's become something of a game in its own right to see just how much I can cheat it and make it function as unlike 2k3 as possible, and bonus points if I can do it smoothly enough that it looks like 2k3 was designed for it in the first place.
That said, I still voted yes, because it sounds like a fun tool in its own right.
The reason I say this is because I have made the majority of my games in 2k3 and what makes it interesting for me is that very limitation of only having the events to make custom systems. It's become something of a game in its own right to see just how much I can cheat it and make it function as unlike 2k3 as possible, and bonus points if I can do it smoothly enough that it looks like 2k3 was designed for it in the first place.
That said, I still voted yes, because it sounds like a fun tool in its own right.
Aldu
1020
Thanks for your responses. I've decided to not pursue this project any further since it seems there's no real interest in it and I probably won't use RM2k3 anymore after I finish my current game.
Darken
3952
Well damn didn't need to burst your bubble. I guess I was mostly interested in how to better streamline stuff like this because I do think RM2K3 has its strengths and it is worth making the program easier for everyone.
As far as the raw numbers go, idk I think many RM2K3 users are already experienced or looking to make a fan-game of Yume Nikki/Off or something (if thats even a thing anymore) so there isn't really a way to know how much use there could be for it. I still think the best use is just really simple menu templates for non-RPGs but again hard to say how far that reaches.
As far as the raw numbers go, idk I think many RM2K3 users are already experienced or looking to make a fan-game of Yume Nikki/Off or something (if thats even a thing anymore) so there isn't really a way to know how much use there could be for it. I still think the best use is just really simple menu templates for non-RPGs but again hard to say how far that reaches.
Aldu
1020
In terms of streamlining, that was the purpose of this engine. It was supposed to be an easy and quick way to make a CMS with no programming required. As long as you know how Picture spritesheets work, you could create a CMS. For creating pictures, I guess the best option would be to develop a separate program that helps you generate them.
I thought the same thing but after spending time on the RM2K3 channel in the /r/RPGMaker discord, I still see new people asking how to create custom systems in RM2k3. The worst part is I have to tell them there's no easy way to make it as a beginner whereas with modern versions, it's like "use this plugin". I even spoke with a developer making a commercial game using RM2k3 and they refuse to use maniacs patch because they don't want to risk breaking the EULA even though it passes. That's what lead me to conceptualize this idea and create a prototype. Unfortunately, I'm also a working adult so I don't have the time to develop something that will be underused.
I thought the same thing but after spending time on the RM2K3 channel in the /r/RPGMaker discord, I still see new people asking how to create custom systems in RM2k3. The worst part is I have to tell them there's no easy way to make it as a beginner whereas with modern versions, it's like "use this plugin". I even spoke with a developer making a commercial game using RM2k3 and they refuse to use maniacs patch because they don't want to risk breaking the EULA even though it passes. That's what lead me to conceptualize this idea and create a prototype. Unfortunately, I'm also a working adult so I don't have the time to develop something that will be underused.
Maniacs Patch - Hm we have the patch EULA for this reason: https://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?threads/rpg-maker-2003-patch-eula.42021/
Modify rpg_rt.ldb: You can do that using liblcf: https://github.com/EasyRPG/liblcf
You can also go the route of using the clipboard as a way to import and export parts of RM data such as event code, like RMEventFactory does: https://rpgmaker.net/forums/topics/5811/ (if you are interested, I can go a bit more into detail about the clipboard formats)
Modify rpg_rt.ldb: You can do that using liblcf: https://github.com/EasyRPG/liblcf
You can also go the route of using the clipboard as a way to import and export parts of RM data such as event code, like RMEventFactory does: https://rpgmaker.net/forums/topics/5811/ (if you are interested, I can go a bit more into detail about the clipboard formats)
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