HIDDEN MECHANICS

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Rhyme
Tear Harvester Rhyme
7582
Do you tell the player everything that goes on behind your game?

What determines which game mechanic is to be presented and which to hide?

Due to the nature of the hidden mechanics themselves and partially due to my aversion of trying to include walls of text in the tutorial, they tend to never get noticed and not many players take advantage of it. When they do notice it, sometimes it gets disregarded as a coincidence.
It's always something I've been wondering how to deal with well, without over-introducing all sorts of un-necessary mechanics that may or may not be important but might help the player progress easier if they are aware and can take advantage of.

Stick hints in NPC dialogue and/or examinable objects?
A loading screen/menu screen that pops up random hints ever so often?
Game over screen providing a hint that is relevant to how the player lost?

Oh, and if you feel like sharing, do share what sort of hidden mechanics you have in your games!
slash
APATHY IS FOR COWARDS
4158
Hmm, I think it depends on what you're trying to accomplish with hiding the mechanics. It's worth pointing out anything obscure (Like "Press K on your keyboard to eat Kale") because it's silly to think that the player would ever try that on their own, and if they did it wouldn't have that same sense of discovery - it would just feel like luck.

The best way to add "hidden" mechanics, in my opinion, is to create systems that can be expanded upon naturally by the curious, but could also be totally ignored. For example, you may introduce a player to a crafting system by teaching them how to mix two items together. Your tutorial would involve them making something basic (Stick + Metal = Sword) but then you leave the rest to them - you don't have to tell them that they can make potions by mixing Apple + Bottle. Let them play around with it themselves, if they're interested.

I messed around with an idea like this for the original Lily. On the map screen, Lily could KICK things at the cost of a little MP, and things would react differently. KICKing NPCs would get special (angry) dialogue from them. If you KICKed an enemy, you'd start the fight by dealing a little preemptive damage to them. I had plans for a bunch of things to KICK (trees might drop apples, you might disarm a trapped chest) but I wasn't going to tell players what KICK did, just that they could do it. I think something like that is a great way to reward players who want to experiment.
I think the one mechanic you never have to explain is the RNG - chances are that the developer doesn't know how it works.

What's mostly important is understanding what mechanics are there and what purpose they serve. While most RPGs tend not to explain game mechanics to players, how much of a problem it is depends on whether your game is very simple (like Dragon Quest) or very complex (like Nethack).
Ratty524
The 524 is for 524 Stone Crabs
12986
author=Rhyme
Do you tell the player everything that goes on behind your game?

If you literally mean "everything" then my answer is no. I don't think anyone else tells absolutely everything to their players, either. Does Final Fantasy tell you the damage calculations of your basic attacks? Does Mario give you an explanation about the fine details of how its jump physics work?

Learning those help you become better at those games, but they are not pertinent to playing the game itself. That being said...

author=Rhyme
What determines which game mechanic is to be presented and which to hide?

What determines that is how important that mechanic is to playing your game. Say you have a thunder skill that does damage and a chance to stun enemies. If stunning enemies is not a required effort to get through the main game, then it can afford to be something that's left obtusely described, in my opinion. If it's part of any integral strategy to beat a certain boss, however, then that's information you don't want to leave out, otherwise players will feel like the game's "cheating" them.

author=Rhyme
Due to the nature of the hidden mechanics themselves and partially due to my aversion of trying to include walls of text in the tutorial, they tend to never get noticed and not many players take advantage of it. When they do notice it, sometimes it gets disregarded as a coincidence.
It's always something I've been wondering how to deal with well, without over-introducing all sorts of un-necessary mechanics that may or may not be important but might help the player progress easier if they are aware and can take advantage of.


I think all games have some sort of "hidden mechanic" just to make the game function (or at least they should), as I implied above in my Mario example. The players not caring about these subtle mechanics is something to be expected and comes naturally. It's not something I think people should view as a problem or something that needs fixing, because if you are really asking that sort of question, then maybe your "hidden mechanic" should really be a "core/noticeable" mechanic instead?
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Hmm, here's an example from UOSSMUD, one of my games, and how I made the decision.

UOSSMUD has a class change system. Different classes have different stat bonuses. Knight has bonuses to attack, pdef, mdef, HP, MP, block, and evasion for example. Monk has bonuses to attack, strength, agility, pdef, HP, block, and evasion, but it has higher HP, attack and evasion bonuses than Knight, and lower pdef and block bonuses.

There's no tutorial explaining this. The player can see in their status screen which stats are being increased by thir current class, if they look, but they can't tell by how much. There's no easy way to tell that monk gives more attack power than knight. In fact, attack, magic power, pdef, mdef, block and evade are totally invisible stats that the player can't see anywhere (they are actually derived stats based on the player's strength, wisdom, agility, vitality and willpower, which are visible). This is further complicated by the fact that the stat bonuses given by each class increase as you level up - Knights get +30% HP at level 1 and +45% HP at level 100. After level 100 the stat bonuses stop growing; another thing players aren't told, since they aren't actually told that they grow in the first place.

This whole system is pretty complex, which is the main reason there's no explanation given to players. The format of the game also makes it very hard to give any more tutorials after level 1, since it is a nonlinear open world game. But really, the biggest reason is that knowing this info wouldn't affect their decision-making in any meaningful way. There are cases where not knowing something can cause the player to make bad decisions, but this isn't one. The classes all have different abilities, and normal attacks barely exist in this game, so the player already knows every job is different. Knight and Monk do different things. It's enough for Knight to be better at knighting and Monk to be better at monking. The numbers behind that don't really matter that much. If we displayed all those numbers and bonuses, players would take an extra 15 minutes figuring out how to optimize each new setup they changed to, instead of just playing the game, and there would be extremely little difference in their power. Unfun.
Red_Nova
Sir Redd of Novus: He who made Prayer of the Faithless that one time, and that was pretty dang rad! :D
9192
I try to stage the first level in a way that helps players recognize patterns on their own and figure out the mechanics themselves. In my current game's first battle, for example, using your only method of inflicting damage on an enemy at the beginning will not do any damage. But if you use your only other ability to damage an enemy's stamina instead of health, then try attacking again, they'll finally do damage. All without a single tutorial prompt.

If you're making a more traditional RPG, and if there's no serious number crunching required, players can probably get by with the general idea of, "Making my numbers bigger will make my problems smaller!" So an explanation of exactly how that works probably will be forgotten about ten minutes later.

In general, I think explaining every hidden mechanic in the game will bore the player. Start by explaining mechanics that players have the most direct use of or control over. If it's battle damage formulas, a short text description like, "A powerful fireball to one enemy," will stick with the player much easier than "(40 + 2 * a.mat) * (20 + a.mat) / (20 + a.mat + 2 * b.mdf)" ever will.
Craze
why would i heal when i could equip a morningstar
15170
Ratty524
Does Final Fantasy tell you the damage calculations of your basic attacks? Does Mario give you an explanation about the fine details of how its jump physics work?

Learning those help you become better at those games, but they are not pertinent to playing the game itself. That being said...


ACTUALLY.

FF damage aside (they have horrific calculations anyway), I'd posit that Mario DOES tell you the fine details, through intelligent and purposeful level design. You must master the physics by the end of the game in order to make it through.

Rhyme
Due to the nature of the hidden mechanics themselves and partially due to my aversion of trying to include walls of text in the tutorial, they tend to never get noticed and not many players take advantage of it. When they do notice it, sometimes it gets disregarded as a coincidence.
It's always something I've been wondering how to deal with well, without over-introducing all sorts of un-necessary mechanics that may or may not be important but might help the player progress easier if they are aware and can take advantage of.


Gonna use Tales of Zestiria as an example. The game is based on the fighting game genre in a 3d playing field. There are a LOT of little techniques you can use to get ahead, like knowing when your combo ends (leaving you open), knowing when to block or evade, understanding that your SC (MP) bar being full increases your damage, etc. etc. etc. Again, there's a lot. Buuut there's four ways that it tells the player all of this information!

1) Tutorials. The early battles, naturally, have big prompts that come up explaining what to do. This is pretty standard. The same goes for the game's other core systems (fusion, the skill grid).

2) Character interaction. By investigating an enemy mid-battle, your characters will comment on it and its attack patterns/weaknesses/etc. For normal enemies, killing one successfully will unlock a second comment that's even more in-depth. This is all described within the character's way of speaking, of course, making it fun and easy to comprehend instead of just INFO DUMP. I'll show some screenshots when i get home

3) Monoliths. These are big stone tablets scattered across the dungeons, towns and overworld that give you permanent pages for your in-game strategy guide, which you can pull up any time outside of battle/cutscenes. By giving you the info in tiny chunks, and by storing it in an easy-to-reference guide, you can learn the more "hidden" mechanics bit by bit to incorporate into your gameplay.

4) Battle Actions. These are passives that you must consciously equip, allowing you to opt-in to more advanced mechanics, or instead spend your AP (think FF9 passive style, but for the whole party) on crutches/handicaps to help out. For example, by equipping Greater Heights and Something Else (i forget), you can chain your skills/spells together by holding down a button. It requires knowing that chains into what and having the desire to actually do so, but it's very useful. Having the player actually tick a box to opt-in makes it that much more conscious and pertinent.

so yeah. small chunks over time! i try to do this with most of my games, most recently (...yesterday...) with the sheep in RAMSFORTH. saving sheep lets you talk to them in the pasture, and some give you hints on how to maximize your battle effectiveness.

as for actual hidden mechanics I use? i try to be as transparent as possible without inundating the player. i can't think of any, really. i love counters and gauges so i just show everything on the screen!
I usually tell my players all the rules about the combat system itself, since I want the playing ground to be even, and I expect the player to use the system to the maximum in order to win.

I think the only time I've never explicitly mentioned a mechanic is in Heresies of Discord. Mostly because I wanted the player to feel smart if they discovered it and used it.



Basically, the game is 1v1 ATB duels, where turns pass every few seconds. Since turns and actions are independent of one another, the player can game the system with careful timing.

Example: One skill does a lot of damage, but your ATB bar refills more slowly until the next turn. So if you wait until it's JUST about to change turns, you can practically skip the downside.
In my game (RMXP), both strength and dexterity contributes to physical damage. I will tell the players that, but I will not tell the players the exact damage formulas. Strength will be more important than dexterity against enemies with high defense while the opposite is true against enemies with high evasion. Again, I will tell the player that, but not how exactly the stats work. This amount of information is enough for the players to make informed decisions and the exact formulas will not be helpful for the majority.

I prefer this approach in general, if X is going to be a thing, tell the player so, but skip the details.

Rhyme
Tear Harvester Rhyme
7582
Thank you for all the replies!
As clarification, I don't necessarily refer to how the numbers get to be or calculation when it comes to hidden mechanics.

I'd tell the player that the Attack stat affects critical damage, but they don't need to know exactly how Attack affects it, even more so when the Critical Damage derived parameter is directly shown in a status screen. I'd tell the player Luck decreases damage variance, but do not feel the need to tell them that damage variance itself starts from the difference between the target and subject's Luck parameters.

However, what about presenting hidden mechanics that are generally regarded as "too tryhard" to tell to the average player? Things that as a developer, I'm aware that the player doesn't need to know, but I want them to know.
Pokemon has a lot: it's IV/EV system, happiness, STAB(actually, was this ever informed to the player? I don't have a good memory), and attack priorities among other things.
In it's defense, Pokemon does have some vague hints that tell you about the above hidden mechanics by talking to certain NPCs, but nevertheless it stays pretty obscure unless you look it up online.

Whether presenting all the extra mechanics to the player is a good idea or not is definitely also a concern depending on the game design though!

e: I guess to an extent, it could also be interpreted as "how obscure or clear-cut should the mechanics be explained to the player?"
Red_Nova
Sir Redd of Novus: He who made Prayer of the Faithless that one time, and that was pretty dang rad! :D
9192
I've beaten pretty much every generation through Diamond and Pearl and I've never made use of the IV/EV system (hell, I'm still not completely sure how it works). In fact, the only groups of people (that I've seen) that care about such systems are competitive players or selective breeders. If your game has those kinds of hidden mechanics, then explaining them really depends on your target audience. To me, sticking NPCs that give hints of these systems will be fine, but making a mandatory tutorial of them is a no-no.

You could possibly deliver mechanics tutorials in the skill descriptions. For example, "Fireball to one enemy. Inflicts Burn, which causes damage over time." It's short, sweet, and teaches players how the game works one fragment at a time. Later skills probably don't need this, but this would be helpful in the beginning. Keeping those early skills through the late game can double as a quick reference if players need a reminder of what certain mechanics do.

To use the EV example, assuming I understand how it works, when viewing a Pokemon in the Pokedex, you could have a section listing the EV points it gives upon being defeated. Couple that with an explanation from an NPC, and players that care enough should be able to figure it out. But yeah, "tryhard" mechanics can be pretty tricky to explain, and the longer I'm writing this, the less sure I am that this is a good idea. Hm...
I think when it comes down to it, players are more concerned about basics on how things work in a relevant way rather than HARD ASS MATH. Not to say that you should be adverse to revealing formulas if applicable, but a lot of times it isn't necessary other than say, letting your players know that EVA is calculated heavily from SPD. For the average player, that's all they'll need to know. Those more inclined are always more than welcome to delve deeper.

As to how to get that information to the players, creators have a lot of cool ways to do that.

Tutorials are always welcome. Some games (like my own) have a tutorial accessible through the menu as more of the game opens up. Just don't have your players sit through a long ass, boring ass tutorial just once and never again, and don't insult your players time by having a bunch of tutorials on things that should be obvious or very general.
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