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ISSUE WITH THE GAME SUBMISSION RULES.
Posts
ReynardFrost
13
ReynardFrost
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Closeauthor=RMN
The Game section is limited to games that are produced by indie developers; that is, your non-commercial, 100% free game.
Any submission advertising a commercial game is NOT allowed.
An indie developer is one that creates a game without the aid of a publisher. There are plenty of indie games that are commercial. *Cough* Offspring Fling *Cough*
I'd like to share my game on your site (Ruins of Rydos, can check it out on RMWeb) but the rules clearly state any game with the idea of submitting commercially will not be accepted. I can understand not spamming the area with BUY MY GAME NAO messages, but I'd like to share the game's progress as I develop it and get some feedback from the community here. I already have a demo that is freely playable and plan on updating it with the Beta state of the game in the coming months. The demos will of course be free and can give the community a gist of how the full game will be. Is there any way the rules can be changed? An exception made? Some clarification?
Just curious, thanks for your time.
The reason why RMN doesn't host commercial games is largely a practical one - I don't have the staffing, resources, tools, legal knowhow nor server reliability to run a site that supports commercial ventures.
As for the kickstarter stuff - I also support members'/former-members' commercial game initiatives, but I won't allow that game to have a gameprofile here. But I will do things like allow forum posts, or now that I have released RMN v4.3, have banners and frontpagespots promoting their games.
If you have a commercial game you want me to hock, let me know and I can help out if I can!
I also have vague plans in the future to have a section on RMN for commercial game by former/current members, segregated from the main games list. The games wouldn't be hosted here, but I would link to that games'/creators' personal site.
I hope that clarifies things!
I am willing to discuss the subject of commercial games by indie devs on RMN, though!
As for the kickstarter stuff - I also support members'/former-members' commercial game initiatives, but I won't allow that game to have a gameprofile here. But I will do things like allow forum posts, or now that I have released RMN v4.3, have banners and frontpagespots promoting their games.
If you have a commercial game you want me to hock, let me know and I can help out if I can!
I also have vague plans in the future to have a section on RMN for commercial game by former/current members, segregated from the main games list. The games wouldn't be hosted here, but I would link to that games'/creators' personal site.
I hope that clarifies things!
I am willing to discuss the subject of commercial games by indie devs on RMN, though!
To be honest, the policy was around before I ever was staff, and I have no strong philosophical objections to indie devs posting commercial works here. More or less I've just maintained status quo. I really don't want slick barely-indie devs parachuting in and dropping their games here and then never returning, though. But I am open to the idea of ambitious hobbyists posting their RM or GM or Unity or whathaveyou games, though!
So discuss and debate away RMNers! I want to hear your opinions on this. (Keep in mind no policies have changed or anything)
So discuss and debate away RMNers! I want to hear your opinions on this. (Keep in mind no policies have changed or anything)
One of the reasons I got turned off from sites like IndieDB is because high-profile games like Minecraft were posted there and totally drowned out the entire hobbyist audience. I don't particularly want to see that happen here. Although I think it would be cool to see commercial works from other members in the community, I think we stand to lose a lot by primarily commercial developers just using it as a place to hawk their goods.
A potential (albeit inelegant) solution would be to require a certain amount of makerscore to post a commercial game, which would just serve to try to keep people from diving in, posting their game, and then never coming back.
A potential (albeit inelegant) solution would be to require a certain amount of makerscore to post a commercial game, which would just serve to try to keep people from diving in, posting their game, and then never coming back.
ReynardFrost
13
Yeah I'm not saying everyone who wants to post a commercial game should be able to do so. I'd want to keep it within the RM Community. I was just curious if I could submit my game that I eventually plan on selling if it got accepted on Steam (Via Greenlight) or Desura. I mostly wanted to share my game to get feedback.
Out of curiosity (haven't found a proper section for it) where could I post a topic about my game?
Out of curiosity (haven't found a proper section for it) where could I post a topic about my game?
That is what I don't want to ever happen here. But I don't even know if something like could ever happen here - I mean, there is already a higher profile place like IndieDB, right? Why would RMN be a target destination for something Minecraft-esque?
Is there a term for "hobbyists indie developers but not-hardcore high profile drown-out-the-rest" ?
EDIT:
if you have a commercial video game, the Videogame forum is the place for it (for now!). That's where harmonic posted about his game.
Is there a term for "hobbyists indie developers but not-hardcore high profile drown-out-the-rest" ?
EDIT:
if you have a commercial video game, the Videogame forum is the place for it (for now!). That's where harmonic posted about his game.
ReynardFrost
13
For starters, restricting "commercial" projects to whatever engines you have listed on RMN would restrict some projects. But honestly, if you're worried about something minecraft-esque it would become mightily apparent very quickly that it was drowning out the rest, and could be removed. (I'm sure folks would report it if it felt out of place.)
Hobbyists are people who make indie games for fun, and never plan on selling them.
Indie developers are ones who make games because it's what they want to do as a career, or their life, and can either have their game free or plan on selling it (their own discretion). The term indie just means you don't have a publisher paying for your expenses and has a say in the game.
Like if Activision were publishing my game, I wouldn't be indie.
Also:
You don't have to be commercial to do this. Most hobbyists do this with their projects. Plus, it would be much better to host a game where the developer is actually taking it seriously instead of making a crap FF fangame that has no originality or forethought (and will likely never be finished).
Hobbyists are people who make indie games for fun, and never plan on selling them.
Indie developers are ones who make games because it's what they want to do as a career, or their life, and can either have their game free or plan on selling it (their own discretion). The term indie just means you don't have a publisher paying for your expenses and has a say in the game.
Like if Activision were publishing my game, I wouldn't be indie.
Also:
author=kentona
I really don't want slick barely-indie devs parachuting in and dropping their games here and then never returning, though.
You don't have to be commercial to do this. Most hobbyists do this with their projects. Plus, it would be much better to host a game where the developer is actually taking it seriously instead of making a crap FF fangame that has no originality or forethought (and will likely never be finished).
Here's a question, though, what would be the benefit to RMN for hosting commercial games and placing them alongside the hobbyist?
on the flipside, what would a commercial indie dev look for from RMN? (A portal just to link back to their official website? Would the tools we have here (blogs, pages, notifications, hosting, etc..) be of any real use to them?)
There is a lot to ponder here and I haven't given it much thought yet.
on the flipside, what would a commercial indie dev look for from RMN? (A portal just to link back to their official website? Would the tools we have here (blogs, pages, notifications, hosting, etc..) be of any real use to them?)
There is a lot to ponder here and I haven't given it much thought yet.
Dyhalto
7536
Do we have to have this discussion so often? It's RMN's house, with RMN's rules. There are lots of places to dump your sales pitch and hope for hits.
This makes me lol for inside-community reasons.
author=ReynardFrost
Plus, it would be much better to host a game where the developer is actually taking it seriously instead of making a crap FF fangame that has no originality or forethought (and will likely never be finished).
This makes me lol for inside-community reasons.
ReynardFrost
13
author=kentona
Here's a question, though, what would be the benefit to RMN for hosting commercial games and placing them alongside the hobbyist?
on the flipside, what would a commercial indie dev look for from RMN? (A portal just to link back to their official website? Would the tools we have here (blogs, pages, notifications, hosting, etc..) be of any real use to them?)
There is a lot to ponder here and I haven't given it much thought yet.
I just wanted to host the game to get some feedback. See what people thought, how I could improve it. Feedback is always appreciated. I'm not even trying to sell my game yet, I'm still making it. I just plan on making it commercial when I finish it. I only brought up the discussion to be upfront and honest.
author=Dyhalto
Do we have to have this discussion so often? It's RMN's house, with RMN's rules. There are lots of places to dump your sales pitch and hope for hits.
As I said above, I'm not trying to go for a sales pitch. I just want to share my game's info and get some feedback, see what people think of current and future demos, how I can improve, etc. If I were just trying to sell the game I wouldn't even bother posting here. XD
I guess a better question of it would be, is it alright to post my game and get feedback and stuff as long as I'm not trying to "sell" the game directly on this site and more just going for feedback?
Dyhalto
7536
Dyad had a gamepage for awhile. Once Erilex expressed his intention to go full-on commercial, he withdrew his profile. Jude did something similiar with Necropolis.
You might be able to host a gamepage during the early development stages for feedback and fanbase building. It wouldn't be unprecedented. Confer with kentona about it.
(after some Googling, there's a different, more-famous indie game called Dyad. Someone should notify erilex)
You might be able to host a gamepage during the early development stages for feedback and fanbase building. It wouldn't be unprecedented. Confer with kentona about it.
(after some Googling, there's a different, more-famous indie game called Dyad. Someone should notify erilex)
author=kentona
I really don't want slick barely-indie devs parachuting in and dropping their games here and then never returning, though.
Mhh, I don't remember this being a reason the last time this was discussed. And quite frankly I don't know why it is an issue all of a sudden and having tons of practice newbie games is not. Besides, some people already do that. I see it the most among non-english speaking developers. They practically just host here, they don't try to involve themselves with the community or anything.
author=kentona
on the flipside, what would a commercial indie dev look for from RMN? (A portal just to link back to their official website? Would the tools we have here (blogs, pages, notifications, hosting, etc..) be of any real use to them?)
The way I like to see this is: Would Erilex? Would Jude? Would harmonic? I'm sure they would! If they once did, they still can... I favor the allowing of commercial games mostly as a way to keep the community together and strong. I hate to see cool projects go (The ones we need around here the most) because of a silly rule and just to have a mention on the side.
author=kentona
The reason why RMN doesn't host commercial games is largely a practical one - I don't have the staffing, resources, tools, legal knowhow nor server reliability to run a site that supports commercial ventures.
This is probably the most legitimate reason, but I still have my doubts. Like I keep saying, it wouldn't be any different hosting a commercial game than a non commercial one. It's just hosting! Nothing else has to change. ...What I think the problem is, is not lack of resources, but lack of conviction. It's like, rmn is upside down when it comes to what's in and what's out.
I'd like to think of it as this: alterego's posts are usually the opposite of what kentona says, no matter what the topic is or their previous positions.
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
author=kentona
Here's a question, though, what would be the benefit to RMN for hosting commercial games and placing them alongside the hobbyist?
I think this would actually lend a higher air of legitimacy to the hobbyist games, if you consider that a benefit.
Or if by "benefit to RMN" you really mean a literal benefit to RMN rather than just a benefit to members of RMN, then you could charge people a fee to post commercial games.
The Game section of RMN is designed to release and advertise your projects. Game projects should be of your own creation and should show some sort of general progress. The Game section is limited to games that are produced by indie developers. Any playable game you submit to RMN must be free to play.
RMN does not have the staffing, resources, tools, legal expertise, nor server reliability to support commercial ventures.
If you intend to sell your game commercially, all sales must be done outside of RMN's website. We are not an online shop. You also must flag the game as a Commercial game in the gameprofile. Soliciting donations for your project is acceptable (including a link to a Kickstarter). Your commercial gameprofile is eligible to be up on RMN during the development of your game and after the game is completed. However, any game downloads or game download links submitted to RMN must be free to play.
^how does this sound to people?
RMN does not have the staffing, resources, tools, legal expertise, nor server reliability to support commercial ventures.
If you intend to sell your game commercially, all sales must be done outside of RMN's website. We are not an online shop. You also must flag the game as a Commercial game in the gameprofile. Soliciting donations for your project is acceptable (including a link to a Kickstarter). Your commercial gameprofile is eligible to be up on RMN during the development of your game and after the game is completed. However, any game downloads or game download links submitted to RMN must be free to play.
^how does this sound to people?
I think in a way it breaks what the "spirit" of the site is supposed to be, but on the other hand, it's RPGMaker.net. If folks make commercial games with the tool that the site is named after, I don't see an issue with letting them post it here.
I'm not so sure that any commercial games should get any front page attention, however. Or if they do, they ought to have their own section on the front page.
I'm not so sure that any commercial games should get any front page attention, however. Or if they do, they ought to have their own section on the front page.
