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DEMO LENGTH
Posts
Neverm0re
341
Neverm0re
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CloseOk, I have no idea if this is the appropriate place to ask this, but what is a good length for a game demo? Or is it less a matter of length and more about the player being able to get a feel for the game? Since I already have a feel for my game, it is kinda hard for me to judge that last one myself, and my girlfriend refuses to play because the game scares her too much V_V
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
Heh. Mine is the first dungeon. If your first dungeon is lacking in gameplay you should probably redesign the first dungeon to make your game's first impression not be so boring use a dungeon later in the game for the demo.
But it depends what your goal is with the demo. Do you want to create player interest in your upcoming game? Make it long enough to get them interested, and then end it while they're still salivating, before they start feeling comfortable. Do you want to show off your technical systems? Make it long enough to let the player learn the basics of the systems, get a feel for some of the more interesting uses, but not long enough to feel confident in anything they're doing. If your goal is something else, then do something else.
In both examples, you'll notice I said to end it before the player feels comfortable. There's a reason for this: you want the player to want to play the real game. If the player feels sufficiently satisfied by the demo, they won't have a longing for more, and they won't feel like the game has tons more to offer. And so they won't have any strong urge to keep up with the game for the six or twelve months it takes for you to release the full version.
Alternately, a lot of people release alpha builds of their games that are 30-80% complete and call them "demos." But these aren't demos. They're just unfinished games. If an unfinished game is what you want to release, then go ahead I guess, but do us a favor and don't call it a demo. Because that's not what it is.
But it depends what your goal is with the demo. Do you want to create player interest in your upcoming game? Make it long enough to get them interested, and then end it while they're still salivating, before they start feeling comfortable. Do you want to show off your technical systems? Make it long enough to let the player learn the basics of the systems, get a feel for some of the more interesting uses, but not long enough to feel confident in anything they're doing. If your goal is something else, then do something else.
In both examples, you'll notice I said to end it before the player feels comfortable. There's a reason for this: you want the player to want to play the real game. If the player feels sufficiently satisfied by the demo, they won't have a longing for more, and they won't feel like the game has tons more to offer. And so they won't have any strong urge to keep up with the game for the six or twelve months it takes for you to release the full version.
Alternately, a lot of people release alpha builds of their games that are 30-80% complete and call them "demos." But these aren't demos. They're just unfinished games. If an unfinished game is what you want to release, then go ahead I guess, but do us a favor and don't call it a demo. Because that's not what it is.
Neverm0re
341
Well the section I have in my mind for the demo is about 10-15 minutes in length (maybe more depending on how much wandering around is done), goes through the backstory, hits the two major gameplay styles (mystery and horror), and introduces the main storyline. Would that be too much?
LockeZ
I'd really like to get rid of LockeZ. His play style is way too unpredictable. He's always like this too. If he ran a country, he'd just kill and imprison people at random until crime stopped.
5958
I would lose the backstory. Definitely for the demo, and maybe postpone it until a little later in the real game also.
Length sounds okay. It's on the short side, but if you think it's enough, then it's enough.
Length sounds okay. It's on the short side, but if you think it's enough, then it's enough.
Neverm0re
341
Ok, thank you for the advice. The 10-15 mins was my test run, knowing where to go and what to do. I'll get someone else to play through it to get a more accurate reading and I'll see about stretching it out to closer to 20 mins.
Thank you again ^_^
Thank you again ^_^
Sana
678
My first demo was around 20 mins or so, so 10-15 is just fine. It didn't explain hardly any of the story, but it covered the entire first dungeon~ :)
Neverm0re
341
The reason I had the main character's back story included was because it was so short and simple. She is a reporter for a tabloid paper and she is following up on an urban legend. Done. But since it is nice and short I can take it out without losing more than a few minutes of gameplay.
author=Neverm0re
The reason I had the main character's back story included was because it was so short and simple. She is a reporter for a tabloid paper and she is following up on an urban legend. Done. But since it is nice and short I can take it out without losing more than a few minutes of gameplay.
No need to make arguments for why or why not to include something. If that's what you want to showcase, that's what you should put in your demo, whether it's 10 minutes long or 10 hours.
Most important thing is that it's the first impression you're delivering. For the players sake, preferably not a misleading first impression.
Jparker1984
2008
I like playing demos that have around an hour or two of play. That way I can get a good feel for the game (hopefully) and decided if I want to continue to keep up on the game.
MKID232
435
The demo for my canceled game would definitely fall under LockeZ's Alpha Build defintion.
I wasn't as smart way back in...two years ago.
I wasn't as smart way back in...two years ago.
"Long enough for players to get a taste of what the full experience plays like, but not so long they lose interest"
There's no set length for a demo - good demos can run from 5 minutes to an hour. You want it to be short and sweet relative to your game, though. The player should walk away from the demo having experienced:
1) The game design: Combat, exploration, dialogue trees, whatever your game's main talking points are
2) The aesthetic: What does your game look like? If it has cutscenes, what do they look like?
3) The theme/feel: Is your game fast-paced? Relaxed? Mature and adult? Young and inviting?
This is a shorthand list; but if I play a demo, these are the points that will get me to play the real thing. Don't be afraid to frontload a little for the demo, either - if your game takes a long time to get from the title screen to these points, don't start your demo at the intro. Start at (or right before) a killer moment that really sells your game. You may not realize it, but the player doesn't need to know every bit of your story during the demo - and sometimes the mystery sells the game even better than the story does. If your game isn't about cutscenes, don't make the players sit through 15 minutes of exposition before playing the demo, because you'll lose them.
There's no set length for a demo - good demos can run from 5 minutes to an hour. You want it to be short and sweet relative to your game, though. The player should walk away from the demo having experienced:
1) The game design: Combat, exploration, dialogue trees, whatever your game's main talking points are
2) The aesthetic: What does your game look like? If it has cutscenes, what do they look like?
3) The theme/feel: Is your game fast-paced? Relaxed? Mature and adult? Young and inviting?
This is a shorthand list; but if I play a demo, these are the points that will get me to play the real thing. Don't be afraid to frontload a little for the demo, either - if your game takes a long time to get from the title screen to these points, don't start your demo at the intro. Start at (or right before) a killer moment that really sells your game. You may not realize it, but the player doesn't need to know every bit of your story during the demo - and sometimes the mystery sells the game even better than the story does. If your game isn't about cutscenes, don't make the players sit through 15 minutes of exposition before playing the demo, because you'll lose them.
Shinan
4314
A demo should be long enough so people know what game is about and short enough that they're frustrated that it ended and want to buy the full game.
Tutorial + one mission is a pretty good standard for strategy games and narrative games like RPGs can have a similar thing. Starting out with an early tutorial bit and then jumping forward to an "awesome" bit that ends just before it gets really awesome.
Tutorial + one mission is a pretty good standard for strategy games and narrative games like RPGs can have a similar thing. Starting out with an early tutorial bit and then jumping forward to an "awesome" bit that ends just before it gets really awesome.
amerk
2539
Keep in mind that oftentimes a finished product is different from the demo, which translates into having to replay from the beginning because the old demo saves no longer work. If the demo was short, no problem, but if the demo had been several hours long, that just seems like a waste of time from a player's perspective.
Too short of a demo doesn't give me any idea if I like or it not, and too long may cause me to lose interest (as well as time) for when the final product is released.
My suggestion: Do what the commercial projects do and release an approximate hour of the game. That should be long enough to get an idea of the story, the likes and dislikes, the game play, and the first dungeon and boss fight.
And please don't release demo after demo after demo and expect to receive feedback each and every time. Release one demo when you are comfortable enough, and then go and finish up the game for a final release. With very few exceptions, I will only play a demo once. After that, I ignore it until the game is completed (assuming I enjoyed the demo), no matter how much the developer begs for additional feedback.
Too short of a demo doesn't give me any idea if I like or it not, and too long may cause me to lose interest (as well as time) for when the final product is released.
My suggestion: Do what the commercial projects do and release an approximate hour of the game. That should be long enough to get an idea of the story, the likes and dislikes, the game play, and the first dungeon and boss fight.
And please don't release demo after demo after demo and expect to receive feedback each and every time. Release one demo when you are comfortable enough, and then go and finish up the game for a final release. With very few exceptions, I will only play a demo once. After that, I ignore it until the game is completed (assuming I enjoyed the demo), no matter how much the developer begs for additional feedback.
thatbennyguy
1612
That said, if your game is a constantly updating open-worldish-themed RPG extravaganza, such as some of our most popular games on this site, you can have continual demos with continual feedback. Probably the most popular case of this is Minecraft. But this only works with those games that have emergent sandbox-ish gameplay, such as Hero's Realm, EpiQuest, or some other game where gameplay is "added" on rather than central to the game.
Neverm0re
341
My current project is a horror game with next to 0 RPG elements, so by its nature it is going to be shorter than most rpgs. I've settled on a 15-20 min mark for the demo, aiming for maybe 3-5 hours for the finished product (though I'm not sure if I want to end it where I orginally planned or work it and my sequel idea into one game, which would make it much, much longer, maybe 10-15 hours. Regardless, that is neither here nor there)
noellechan
529
I'm a newbie here to rpgmaker.net and RPG Maker VX (which I'm currently working with). This topic gave me real pause about the direction my demo should be going. I'm afraid everything and the kitchen sink was thrown in (aka, one of those "demos" that's just an unfinished game). I sat back, thought about and instead of starting from the beginning (which was a big change in direction!) I'd come in sometime after. Lots of thanks guys for this discussion.
I'm just making a part of my game so far, my first dungeon will only come later. Is there something about first towns, or quests as demos? Does it matter the way you go with your games, for where you start your demos? I'd say my games are a little less on puzzles, and more on fighting and storyline(playing too much Game Boy Advance when I started making games), so should it be like a quest. Or does it really not matter, as long as it shows the player the important things and keep them wanting more?
OmegaHunter
103
I'm no expert (especially having never made a demo myself), but it doesn't sound like you're ready to release yours yet. Depending on how long your game is, you should probably finish the first story arc before you even bother with a demo. The demo should reflect the gameplay, atmosphere, a bit of the story, etc. I might be reading your post wrong but it sounds like you're too early in development right now. Finish the first "arc" or "segment" of the game, then pick a section of that to build a demo from. By then, you should know what really defines your game and you'll have a better idea of what to release to represent the entire game you're working on.
